Overlapping Dogs - Need Advice!

[Rattlesnake Gal]

I’ve been visiting this Forum off and on for a few years now. What a great site!!! It is my hope that you might have some good advice about adding another Cairn Terrier to our family.

MacKinnon, (Mac) is now 10 years old. He has been an only dog his whole life. Used to be social with other dogs until bout 5 years ago. At a little league baseball game, a stray dog came up to him and stuck its nose in Mac’s butt. I tried to walk away, but the dog stuck like glue. Ever since then he goes Cujo on other dogs. I’m strongly suspicious that he only gets this way near me. At the kennel, he doesn’t pay attention to the other dogs and this summer, my son had luck being in close proximity to my brother’s dog. Not truly worried about fixing Mac. When he is going to be near others, into his soft sided crate he goes – avoidance.

The idea of overlapping dogs is appealing for many reasons, especially for ease of training. Mac is a wonderful dog and we love his behavior! A puppy might help keep him more active too. My vet says that at this age, there is no fixing his aggressive behavior at his advanced age. He also says that the only way Mac will accept another dog is with it being a young puppy. Is he right?

Should we take the chance of disrupting Mac and if we do get another Cairn, will it matter if it is male or female?

I have only had experiences with male dogs.

Thank you so much in advance with this dilemma. I value your knowledge and experiences.

Sincerely,

Celia

[ScruffynMag]

Hi Celia, I have nothing to add to this discussion as I have only just got my first Cairn this year but I just had to say what an adorable looking dog you have there!

As you know with being a regular visitor to this site, you'll get lots of good advice from the more experienced members. This site is great as you say, I've gained lots of useful knowledge from here.

[Tracy A.]

When ever you bring another dog into a home you have the same considerations... I suggest that you find a good breeder in your area who will work with you in finding the right puppy that will go well with Mac.

I think personality has more to do with the right mix then gender (as long as Mac is fixed)

if mac isn't fixed the new puppy will need to be fixed even if it's male or female....

Two intact boys do not mix well in my opinion.(there are always exceptions)

Bringing a puppy into the house with an adult dog verses bringing in a older dog into the home of an established dog is something than can be debated both says... It all has to do with the personality of the other dog.

I would not completely rule out an older dog, however there is nothing like a having a puppy ..

but like I said it's about personality.

[pindrop]

Unfortunately I too have nothing to offer to this conversation as I don't even have my puppy yet. Two more weeks till we have our new baby. But like ScruffyMag, I just had to jump in and say how adorable your dog looks. Good luck with whatever your decision is and please keep us posted with updates.

[Idaho Cairns]

I strongly support bringing a puppy into a home with an older Cairn. We have been very successful with the transference of behavior from on Cairn to another with our last two puppies. I believe that puppies model their behaviors on the older dog and if that senior Cairn has the personality that you like and behaviors you like, one way to enjoy those characteristics for another generation is to bring in a pup and let it grow up with your dog. We never had any problem with either of the older dog/puppy relationships but our senior dogs were gentle souls with other dogs and always have been--also, they were/are females.

I believe one of the best ways to improve the life of an older beloved Cairn is to acquire a companion for it--Cairns seem to thrive with canine company.

Good luck, you certainly have my strong support in this idea and, even more importantly, you will have two Cairns to enjoy instead of just one--more than double the pleasure in my experience.

[Sam I Am]

I want to start off by welcoming you into the forum AND what a handsome boy Mac is

Jock is 9 1/2 and we have been tossing back and forth about getting another Cairn. We did try bring in a male silky terrier pup who was so aggresive to us and Jock that we had to return the pup to the breeder.It was five days of pure hell. Since then we have been really worried about turning Jock's world upside down again. He was really upset when this rotten kid was with us. So although I agree bringing in a pup can really be a great thing, I am not sure that some older dogs can put up with puppy antics. If a breeder had a female about 1 - 2yrs old that they were looking to sell to a good home we would give that a try for sure.

I think it depends on the resident dog and how he handles being "shared". The last thing I want is to upset Jock all over again. The only thing I suggest is to contact a good breeder who will take the pup back if things dont work out. Even with an older dog I would have to put that stipulation in the sales contract before buying the dog.

[Dempsy's Mom]

What a great picture of Mac. He is a wonderful looking cairn. I too have no advice - I am new to the cairn world, but I learn alot from reading the answers. Good luck with your decision!

[Hawkeye]

Let me first welcome you and Mac to the forum, he is a beautiful guy! I love the dark ears with his coloring.

I recently added a young dog to our family with a 13 year old westie at the time. Bailey was an 8 month old cairn and I worked with the breeder very closely on figuring out if he would fit in with the senior girl. For us it did and more recently I added another cairn puppy (from the same breeder) and this is also working out. The older dog makes the perfect trainer for the new comer.

One of the big difference is our westie has always had a companion and when she passed away we saw a big difference in her mood. She was lost without her companion. I don’t know if it will go as smooth in your case since Mac has been the only dog in the house and seems to have some aggression towards other dogs. I definitely agree with Idaho Cairns that you would have to work with a breeder and bring Mac for a ‘meet and greet’ to see how he reacts. Many breeders also have older cairns that they want to find a good home for. In my case they had started training Bailey for the show ring then changed their mind on showing him, so he was (and is) very calm and obedient. I think it you should continue to look into it and see how Mac interacts with other dogs or puppies. Good luck!

[janis]

Hi Celia

I just wanted to say Hi and great looking little guy! And I have to say, if someone had their nose "stuck like glue in my butt" I would practice avoidance as well! And you think you're safe at a little league game!

[kjwarnold]

When we added Packy to our family, we had 15 yr. old Willie with us, who was in a gradual decline. There was some concern about whether a new puppy would irritate him too much, so our breeder worked with us to find a calmer puppy who was less likely to be too rambunctious. As it turned out, Willie really enjoyed having Packy around and it perked him up some in his last months.

We added Kirby to our family when Packy was 4 yrs. old. Kirby is much more active, which our breeder knew Packy could tolerate since he was younger and more laid back. I'd say working with your breeder to let him/her know about Mac and his past experiences, as well as what you're looking for would be your best bet. By the way, both our boys are neutered, which our breeder insists upon for pets. Two boys work out well for us -- we really enjoy their sweetness and affection!

[Hawkeye]

I wanted to add a note on the gender. My senior citizen is a female and I brought in two males both neutered. Her companion for 12 years was a female. I’m really not sure if it makes a difference in the gender, probably more so having them spayed or neutered. Oh and just to let you know, She is the alpha dog both boys bow down to her. Still the queeny after all these years!

[Sam I Am]

Jock (who is fixed) was raised with a female Scottie and will not tolerate any male dog, big or small. We have tried to work this out but there is no way. He truly loves small female terriers and wont stand for anything else. As our breeders tells us there arent two Cairns the same and sometimes you just have to accept that this is the way it is. So to keep Jock happy if we ever get another Cairn it will definately be a girl.

[cairnrescueleague]

I would work with a trainer first on Mac's dog aggression before considering adding another dog to the household.

[Rattlesnake Gal]

Thank you very much for the excellent advice, the warm welcome and for the compliments on MacKinnon. I have fallen heart and soul for this incredible breed!

I love all the great avatars that show off your babies! Whenever I need a smile, I just pop by this site to see some fine furry or should I say hairy friends.

Mac is fixed and did get along well with my mother in-law’s Pomeranian, so I think a puppy should work out just fine. Now to find just the one!

This newest addition will be the third Cairn in our house. The first time we made a rookie mistake and bought from a pet store. Sam was a good dog, but had trouble with submissive peeing. Almost had that worked through, but it took five years. Then the little rascal broke out and chased a truck. Sad times. I was devastated.

I think that we got very lucky with Mac. Contacted a breeder that was close by and worked it all out. That fell through when she wanted to retain showing rights if her dog’s testicles didn’t distend. (???) We let that one go and found Mac in Pennsylvania. It was as simple as the breeder saying she had a male dog and I agreed. Such a newbie, but it sure worked out well. He has been the dog of a lifetime. We're hoping that we might be blessed enough to get two!

I have found a breeder somewhat close by to us in New Hampshire. The litter hasn’t been born yet and the breeder is advising me to reserve a pup because they get snapped up as soon as she posts them. That would mean that I would not have any control on the personality of this new addition, so I will continue to look.

We’re pretty sure that over-lapping dogs is the way to go for us. Mac would definitely rule the roost. Not sure anyone has told him that he is only 16 ½ pounds! (Bet a lot of you can say the same about your girls and boys too!) You have confirmed what we had thought; the older one really makes a big difference on training the young one. I will keep you posted on where we end up. Thanks so much for the wonderful insight for this very big decision.

Sincerely,

Celia

[josie&holly]

I wish you luck in getting an addition to your family - I think Mac is a very handsome boy!

[Idaho Cairns]

Thank you very much for the excellent advice, the warm welcome and for the compliments on MacKinnon. I have fallen heart and soul for this incredible breed!

I love all the great avatars that show off your babies! Whenever I need a smile, I just pop by this site to see some fine furry or should I say hairy friends.

Mac is fixed and did get along well with my mother in-law’s Pomeranian, so I think a puppy should work out just fine. Now to find just the one!

This newest addition will be the third Cairn in our house. The first time we made a rookie mistake and bought from a pet store. Sam was a good dog, but had trouble with submissive peeing. Almost had that worked through, but it took five years. Then the little rascal broke out and chased a truck. Sad times. I was devastated.

I think that we got very lucky with Mac. Contacted a breeder that was close by and worked it all out. That fell through when she wanted to retain showing rights if her dog’s testicles didn’t distend. (???) We let that one go and found Mac in Pennsylvania. It was as simple as the breeder saying she had a male dog and I agreed. Such a newbie, but it sure worked out well. He has been the dog of a lifetime. We're hoping that we might be blessed enough to get two!

I have found a breeder somewhat close by to us in New Hampshire. The litter hasn’t been born yet and the breeder is advising me to reserve a pup because they get snapped up as soon as she posts them. That would mean that I would not have any control on the personality of this new addition, so I will continue to look.

We’re pretty sure that over-lapping dogs is the way to go for us. Mac would definitely rule the roost. Not sure anyone has told him that he is only 16 ½ pounds! (Bet a lot of you can say the same about your girls and boys too!) You have confirmed what we had thought; the older one really makes a big difference on training the young one. I will keep you posted on where we end up. Thanks so much for the wonderful insight for this very big decision.

Sincerely,

Celia

Why Celia, it is all quite simple, the minute you get your puppy, have Mac just make the pup take the "Cairn Oath"--"Raise your paw and repeat after me, 'I, _____, do swear to be a good dog, to be quiet, to always go potty outside, to listen to my human friends, to ever be gentle and sweet, so help me Toto,'" This simple ceremony was held here just a couple of years ago and everything has worked out just fine. Enjoy!

[kjwarnold]

Idaho Cairns, that's hilarious!

[Hawkeye]

Idaho...I don't know how you get all these pictures, but they're great!

[Rattlesnake Gal]

What a terrific picture! I cannot wait to get our new family member, so we too can have such fun!

[ScruffynMag]

Just fabulous Idaho

[pindrop]

Idaho - that is too funny. Love it!!

[bradl]

I do solemnly swear.

[cairnrescueleague]

So Mac goes Cujo on some dogs, but ignores some (at the kennel) and gets along with others (your brother’s dog and your mother's Pomeranian)? Are the dogs he gets along with male or female? He may be more inclined to accept a female rather than another male. As far as breeders are concerned, I would check the list of breeders at http://members.ctca.us/home.php/breeder-referral. Reputable breeders usually don't post their puppies, they are usually able to place them by word of mouth.

[Rattlesnake Gal]

I found an available 9-week-old female Cairn terrier from a local kennel, that did not advertise. They appear to be reputable and have been in business since the 1960's. The man was both knowledgeable and thoughtful regarding my situation with Mac and very confident that he would accept a female puppy.

Since making the appointment last night for this afternoon, I am having second, third and fourth doubts. At this moment, I am thinking of bailing out and keeping Mac as an only dog. The reading that I have done here on the internet gives me great pause. The personality of the older dog can change drastically, not always for the best. Do I really want to disrupt MacKinnon in such a way? I think it might be selfish of me.

There were two factors in our contemplating adding a puppy. First was to give Mac a canine companion that might help to keep him more active.

The second was the concern of my loved ones of how traumatic it will be for me to lose my boy. At 10 years old, there is no doubt that the clock is starting to wind down. As I sit here composing this post, tears are running down my face with the thought of losing my buddy.

Mac has been an amazing family dog and has brought much happiness to us, especially me. Since getting him, he has been a super important part of my life. My feelings have only gotten deeper over these happy years. Mac was become my complete focus these days, as our children are grown and off to college and law school. I don’t know how I could have managed the empty nest without my little puppers. ;-)

I do have some time to mull things over yet before my appointment this afternoon. My inclination is that it might be best to start at square one with a new puppy when the time comes. It may be more work, especially as I get older too, but we raised an amazing dog this time and there is no reason to think we cannot do it again.

Thank you very much for the input and support! Adding a puppy is such a huge decision and your knowledge and advice has been most appreciated.

Sincerely,

Celia

[Rattlesnake Gal]

I tried to edit my post to say that this breeder did not advertise and that he recommended a female.