jimnconnie Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 Sunday I'm taking Bailey to a Cairn Terrier Club of Ann Arbor, MI sponsored clinic for a precautionary eye exam to check for Ocular Melanosis, which can lead to glaucoma. This is an inherited condition that occurs in Cairns, and Bailey at 5 1/2 yrs old, is nearing the age when it becomes noticeable(7 -12 yrs). The CTCA lists here:Ocular Melanosis as a Health Related Concern. When I lift up Bailey's upper eyelids, I can see some dark colored patches in the white area above the iris. These dark patches are described in the article, so I want to find out if this is normal for his age or not. It's about a 60 mile trip one way, but I think it will be worth it, plus we will no doubt get to see lots & lots of Cairns. Bailey went to the vet this week for a Heartworm Wellness Panel, that included heartworm testing & blood testing for liver enzymes, kidney function, blood cell count, and who knows what else. They called yesterday to say that everything was fine, so we're good for another year, except that he now weighs 18 pounds! I'm blaming that on this long, cold, snowy winter, and I promised to get him down to 16 pounds this summer. Jim, Connie, Bailey & Sophie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlwtheq Posted February 6, 2009 Share Posted February 6, 2009 Have a safe trip...you're doing exactly what I would do. We send all of our best thoughts and prayers to you and your family. The Wilk Pack Max and Nelly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkcrossley Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 very good thing to check out. when my cairn reached the age where it is likely to manifest, i asked my vet to check out his eyes, and the vet had never heard of ocular melanosis. he obviously doesn't doctor many cairns. anyway when i explained it to him he jumped the computer and got right on top it, which i appreciated. but cairn owners can't just wait for the vet to think of these things, because most of them won't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg P Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 Good for you. I hope you have a good time meeting the other cairn terrier owners. This club, like all the Cairn Terrier clubs is deeply concerned about OM. Regional Cairn Clubs, as well as the national club (CTCA) financially supports research looking for the nasty little autosomal gene that is the cause of OM. OM is an insidious disease that seemingly only affects Cairn terriers. In the end, it creates a painful pressure in the eyeball and can result in the physical removal of the eye. One of the problems with OM is that the onset is later in age. Here is a description that I found on OM: Ocular melanosis is an inherited, probably autosomal-dominant condition with a variable age of onset and rate of progression. It results in a thickening and pigmentation of the iris, release of pigmented material into the aqueous, pigment deposition in the sclera/episclera, and to a lesser extent posterior segment pigment deposition. Following extensive pigment deposition in the aqueous drainage pathways it can result in secondary glaucoma. We check all of our dogs eyes yearly for OM and other eye issues with CERF (Canine Eye Registry Foundation) testing. http://www.vmdb.org/history.html Reputable breeders only breed dogs that CERF clear. Hopefully researchers will soon find that nasty little gene to create genetic testing for OM. BTW, if anyone is interested in CERF testing, this testing happens quite often at AKC dog shows. Greg and Val Perry Home of Kula RN CGC, Am. Can. Int'l. CH Cairngorm Coffee Tea or Me RA ME EE2/Can. SE NAJ NAS CGC (Kona), CH Clanmarr's Steele Princess (Hattie) and CH Scotchbroom Thistle The Patriot SE (Sully) Visit: CroftersDream.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kayharley Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 That you for all that information... Please let us know how Baily makes out and I also wish you a safe and pleasant trip. Although I think most of us trust our veterinarians, it is sometimes necessary for us to stay on top of things relating to our Cairns. A good vet should appreciate the involvement like yours did, pkcrossley. It goes both ways.... My vet has a wirecoat terrier and at one visit we got chatting about grooming. She didn't want to hand strip all the time and I told her about the MCK...she never heard about it and was so interested that I printed out some pics and info and gave it to her at our next visit. She was amazed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boats85 Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 Hope everthing turns out ok, and you get to enjoy your trip. As said before let us know how things are going Boats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheila and Misty Posted February 7, 2009 Share Posted February 7, 2009 good news and good to know-I wasnt aware of this possible problem. I will ahve to inform my vets..besides my last one and my two now and they just got a new cairn patient recently-only 4 cairns in 45 years! Im giving them their first hands on with this breed-I can tell they love the idea-but theyre feistier and stronger than any dogs they ever dealt with when it comes to nail trim time-can tell by their faces when they bring them back in the room. but I think since they dont deal with cairns as much its good to bring things up to them and make them aware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimnconnie Posted February 8, 2009 Author Share Posted February 8, 2009 We made our trip to Ann Arbor for Bailey's eye-exam this morning, with good & bad results. First, the bad is that the dark patches that I noticed in Bailey's eyes are indeed pigmentation that signal the beginnings of Ocular Melanosis. But, the good news is that on a scale of 0 - 5 (with 5 being the worst) he is at less than 1. For now, the Veterinarian Ophthamologist who examined him said we should just discuss this with our vet, monitor the condition, and have another exam in a year, unless we notice a significant change. There are medicines available to slow the progress of OM if that should become necessary. All in all, it confirmed my suspicion, but the fact that it is so early made me feel a lot better. Now that we know what may occur in the years ahead, we will be prepared to do whatever is necessary to help our boy through it. I am going to look for a Veterinary Ophthamologist in our area who we can consult with in the future, because I'm sure that or vet is not well versed in this problem, since it is primarily a Cairn Terrier condition and they don't see many Cairns. On the plus side, we did see a lot of Cairns, and a lot of other breeds, while we were there. There were other tests being given too, so it was a very busy place. When we got back home, Sophie was all over Bailey, smelling all those other dogs that he had been socializing with. Jim, Connie, Bailey & Sophie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cairnrescueleague Posted February 9, 2009 Share Posted February 9, 2009 I believe there's a vet at the University of Wisconsin in Madison who's done a lot of research into ocular melanosis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkcrossley Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 we're proud of you for having the guts to go and confront this immediately. you did exactly the right thing. there are several medical strategies, i think, for combatting glaucoma, and you have done your dog a great service by getting into this directly. bailey's future is going to be improved enormously, and he is so lucky to have brave parents who will look out for his comfort and his joy in life. i give you a lot of credit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheila and Misty Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 you made me look real close at Mistys eyes and something is odd about one of her eyes . right next to the pupil is a dark spot as dark as her pupil mostly on the iris but in the light it almost makes her pupil look oval about the size of a 2 dried rice grains side by side.-hmmm. she has more hair that grows on that side and when its too long she starts blinking and squinting -I think her eyelashes curl into her eyes -I need to keep them trimmed. otherwise Im wondering if she was born like that and I never noticed-she doesnt seem to be having any problems seeing or otherwise. unless this happened since her last vet visit-not long ago...wouldnt he have said something? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimnconnie Posted February 10, 2009 Author Share Posted February 10, 2009 you made me look real close at Mistys eyes and something is odd about one of her eyes . right next to the pupil is a dark spot as dark as her pupil mostly on the iris but in the light it almost makes her pupil look oval about the size of a 2 dried rice grains side by side.-hmmm. she has more hair that grows on that side and when its too long she starts blinking and squinting -I think her eyelashes curl into her eyes -I need to keep them trimmed. otherwise Im wondering if she was born like that and I never noticed-she doesnt seem to be having any problems seeing or otherwise. unless this happened since her last vet visit-not long ago...wouldnt he have said something? Sheila, I'm not really sure what you describe might be, I suppose it could be completely normal. Sometimes when the vets are giving our dogs an examination, it is a rather quick look-see. I don't know that I've ever had them use an instrument to look into the eyes, I don't think so. Next visit you should probably as them to take a closer look at Misty's eyes, and mention what you have noticed. Better safe than sorry. Jim, Connie, Bailey & Sophie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimnconnie Posted February 10, 2009 Author Share Posted February 10, 2009 pkcrossley, thank you for your very kind words. Our breeder said not to be too alarmed at this first OM test. She told me that in some dogs, who test positive initially, the disease progresses very slowly, and may not show any change for years. I'm just glad that we now know, and can be prepared for any problems in the future. We're going to our vet Saturday to bring her up to date on this, and I've found a Veterinary Ophthamologist, at the hospital where Bailey had his liver-shunt surgery in 2006, who is well versed in glaucoma. We will see her soon, and develop a plan for monitoring Bailey's condition in the future. As empty-nesters, our dogs are our children, and we will do whatever is necessary for their welfare. Jim Jim, Connie, Bailey & Sophie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheila and Misty Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 you made me look real close at Mistys eyes and something is odd about one of her eyes . right next to the pupil is a dark spot as dark as her pupil mostly on the iris but in the light it almost makes her pupil look oval about the size of a 2 dried rice grains side by side.-hmmm. she has more hair that grows on that side and when its too long she starts blinking and squinting -I think her eyelashes curl into her eyes -I need to keep them trimmed. otherwise Im wondering if she was born like that and I never noticed-she doesnt seem to be having any problems seeing or otherwise. unless this happened since her last vet visit-not long ago...wouldnt he have said something? Sheila, I'm not really sure what you describe might be, I suppose it could be completely normal. Sometimes when the vets are giving our dogs an examination, it is a rather quick look-see. I don't know that I've ever had them use an instrument to look into the eyes, I don't think so. Next visit you should probably as them to take a closer look at Misty's eyes, and mention what you have noticed. Better safe than sorry. Thats what I plan on-unless she shows a problem earlier I will just wait for her next appt.- could (hopefully) be a normal pigmentation-like scruffy had a black spot on his tongue which was nothing. they told me brindles can come up with some odd pimentation.-thanks for your input. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlwtheq Posted February 10, 2009 Share Posted February 10, 2009 pkcrossley, thank you for your very kind words. Our breeder said not to be too alarmed at this first OM test. She told me that in some dogs, who test positive initially, the disease progresses very slowly, and may not show any change for years. I'm just glad that we now know, and can be prepared for any problems in the future. We're going to our vet Saturday to bring her up to date on this, and I've found a Veterinary Ophthamologist, at the hospital where Bailey had his liver-shunt surgery in 2006, who is well versed in glaucoma. We will see her soon, and develop a plan for monitoring Bailey's condition in the future. As empty-nesters, our dogs are our children, and we will do whatever is necessary for their welfare. Jim Glad they caught it early-on and that you've found some expertise to help you monitor the situation. We aren't empty-nesters, but "never-nesters" if you will, so our pups and other nonhumans babies are our children and, just like you, we will do whatever is necessary for their welfare. Keep us posted. Max and Nelly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkcrossley Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 ocular melanosis is believed to be an autosomal dominant disease, which means that any dog that has it will necessarily (i am underscoring necessarily) manifest it, and that any affected dog has a 50 percent chance of passing it on (that is every single dog born by an OM parent has a 50 chance of getting the gene; for entire litters that could mean an affected rate of anywhere between about 25 percent and 75 percent). everybody, including the breeder, has reason to encourage you about bailey, especially now that you have caught it and he is getting care. it is surely true that the rate of development can be slow and therefore the affect on the dog may be minimal. but something about the breeder's reaction seems a bit too casual. i would prefer to hear that the breeder was alarmed and was carefully reviewing the genealogies to find the carrier and make sure that dog is not still breeding, and that his or her offspring are not breeding (it is also just possible that the carrier has not yet shown any symptoms, and could be helped by early intervention). ocular melanosis is not in any sense a life-threatening disease, but it is something that breeders should sound a bit more concerned about, in my opinion. any good breeder can easily have OM dogs show up in early litters (if incoming sires or dams don't have good genealogies behind them), because the symptoms don't appear until a dog is quite mature. but somebody in the business long enough should have a handle on OM dogs who are entering the breeding lines. i don't know what the AKC policy is on informing owners of OM in the genealogy. i could see an argument for minimizing it, since it is not life threatening, but it is serious enough that i could also see an argument for always informing owners of an OM risk in the heritage, and taking immediate steps to minimize the impact of any OM dog on future litters. either way, sort of saying, oh it could be very mild, that doesn't quite get it for me. this is an autosomal dominant trait, which means the genealogy of it is simple and inevitable. if somebody proves later it is not autosomal dominant, then of course it becomes a far more complex thing. but right now the indications are that it is autosomal dominant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cairnrescueleague Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 Bailey also had liver shunt?! The poor boy, he's very lucky to have you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimnconnie Posted February 11, 2009 Author Share Posted February 11, 2009 ocular melanosis is believed to be an autosomal dominant disease, which means that any dog that has it will necessarily (i am underscoring necessarily) manifest it, and that any affected dog has a 50 percent chance of passing it on (that is every single dog born by an OM parent has a 50 chance of getting the gene; for entire litters that could mean an affected rate of anywhere between about 25 percent and 75 percent). everybody, including the breeder, has reason to encourage you about bailey, especially now that you have caught it and he is getting care. it is surely true that the rate of development can be slow and therefore the affect on the dog may be minimal. but something about the breeder's reaction seems a bit too casual. i would prefer to hear that the breeder was alarmed and was carefully reviewing the genealogies to find the carrier and make sure that dog is not still breeding, and that his or her offspring are not breeding (it is also just possible that the carrier has not yet shown any symptoms, and could be helped by early intervention). ocular melanosis is not in any sense a life-threatening disease, but it is something that breeders should sound a bit more concerned about, in my opinion. any good breeder can easily have OM dogs show up in early litters (if incoming sires or dams don't have good genealogies behind them), because the symptoms don't appear until a dog is quite mature. but somebody in the business long enough should have a handle on OM dogs who are entering the breeding lines. i don't know what the AKC policy is on informing owners of OM in the genealogy. i could see an argument for minimizing it, since it is not life threatening, but it is serious enough that i could also see an argument for always informing owners of an OM risk in the heritage, and taking immediate steps to minimize the impact of any OM dog on future litters. either way, sort of saying, oh it could be very mild, that doesn't quite get it for me. this is an autosomal dominant trait, which means the genealogy of it is simple and inevitable. if somebody proves later it is not autosomal dominant, then of course it becomes a far more complex thing. but right now the indications are that it is autosomal dominant. Bailey's Dam was immediately retired from breeding, and placed in a home, when it was discovered that Bailey had Portosystemic Shunt (liver-shunt) in Feb. 2006. His breeder is very involved in the CTCA, and is on the Board of Directors of the Cairn Terrier Club of Detroit. I have no doubts about her dedication to the Cairn breed, and her devotion to the dogs that she breeds, raises, and places with responsible owners. She is currently working with Dr. Sharon Center, Cornell University, in Dr. Center's effort to identify the gene responsible for PSS. Bailey, and the other members of his litter, will be supplying blood samples & DNA to Dr. Center for her research within the next couple of months. Our breeder is involved in raising funds for this very important research, as well as cooperating fully by obtaining the necessary blood and DNA samples from all of the owners of those pups, who are located throughout the United States. I assure you that this breeder also does not take Ocular Melanosis lightly, and is working with the CTCA to find a cure for it. She notified all of her owners, in this area of the clinic that I took Bailey to for his eye exam. She talked to me about OM the last time I had Bailey groomed, told me that it would be wise to have him examined, and then followed up by e-mail to remind me, when the time for the clinic was near. I am certain that she will advise the other owners whose dogs may be at risk that they should have their dogs tested, if they have not already done so. She knows that I am aware of the seriousness, and possible effects of OM, and I think that in her message to me she was simply trying to help me cope with the bad news, not attempting to minimize anything. As you know the cause of OM is not known, and the fact that it often does not show up until later years (7 - 12yrs), make it difficult, if not impossible to predict. I certainly respect your opinion, and understand your concern, but I have the utmost respect for the breeder who gave us two wonderful Cairns, and who I know devotes her life to improving this breed. As we all know, a Cairn from the best breeder may develop health problems, and unbelievably a Cairn from a petstore may go through life with none. Jim, Connie, Bailey & Sophie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg P Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 ocular melanosis is believed to be an autosomal dominant disease, which means that any dog that has it will necessarily (i am underscoring necessarily) manifest it, and that any affected dog has a 50 percent chance of passing it on (that is every single dog born by an OM parent has a 50 chance of getting the gene; for entire litters that could mean an affected rate of anywhere between about 25 percent and 75 percent). everybody, including the breeder, has reason to encourage you about bailey, especially now that you have caught it and he is getting care. it is surely true that the rate of development can be slow and therefore the affect on the dog may be minimal. but something about the breeder's reaction seems a bit too casual. i would prefer to hear that the breeder was alarmed and was carefully reviewing the genealogies to find the carrier and make sure that dog is not still breeding, and that his or her offspring are not breeding (it is also just possible that the carrier has not yet shown any symptoms, and could be helped by early intervention). ocular melanosis is not in any sense a life-threatening disease, but it is something that breeders should sound a bit more concerned about, in my opinion. any good breeder can easily have OM dogs show up in early litters (if incoming sires or dams don't have good genealogies behind them), because the symptoms don't appear until a dog is quite mature. but somebody in the business long enough should have a handle on OM dogs who are entering the breeding lines. i don't know what the AKC policy is on informing owners of OM in the genealogy. i could see an argument for minimizing it, since it is not life threatening, but it is serious enough that i could also see an argument for always informing owners of an OM risk in the heritage, and taking immediate steps to minimize the impact of any OM dog on future litters. either way, sort of saying, oh it could be very mild, that doesn't quite get it for me. this is an autosomal dominant trait, which means the genealogy of it is simple and inevitable. if somebody proves later it is not autosomal dominant, then of course it becomes a far more complex thing. but right now the indications are that it is autosomal dominant. Bailey's Dam was immediately retired from breeding, and placed in a home, when it was discovered that Bailey had Portosystemic Shunt (liver-shunt) in Feb. 2006. His breeder is very involved in the CTCA, and is on the Board of Directors of the Cairn Terrier Club of Detroit. I have no doubts about her dedication to the Cairn breed, and her devotion to the dogs that she breeds, raises, and places with responsible owners. She is currently working with Dr. Sharon Center, Cornell University, in Dr. Center's effort to identify the gene responsible for PSS. Bailey, and the other members of his litter, will be supplying blood samples & DNA to Dr. Center for her research within the next couple of months. Our breeder is involved in raising funds for this very important research, as well as cooperating fully by obtaining the necessary blood and DNA samples from all of the owners of those pups, who are located throughout the United States. I assure you that this breeder also does not take Ocular Melanosis lightly, and is working with the CTCA to find a cure for it. She notified all of her owners, in this area of the clinic that I took Bailey to for his eye exam. She talked to me about OM the last time I had Bailey groomed, told me that it would be wise to have him examined, and then followed up by e-mail to remind me, when the time for the clinic was near. I am certain that she will advise the other owners whose dogs may be at risk that they should have their dogs tested, if they have not already done so. She knows that I am aware of the seriousness, and possible effects of OM, and I think that in her message to me she was simply trying to help me cope with the bad news, not attempting to minimize anything. As you know the cause of OM is not known, and the fact that it often does not show up until later years (7 - 12yrs), make it difficult, if not impossible to predict. I certainly respect your opinion, and understand your concern, but I have the utmost respect for the breeder who gave us two wonderful Cairns, and who I know devotes her life to improving this breed. As we all know, a Cairn from the best breeder may develop health problems, and unbelievably a Cairn from a petstore may go through life with none. Beautifully articulated. Thank you. Greg and Val Perry Home of Kula RN CGC, Am. Can. Int'l. CH Cairngorm Coffee Tea or Me RA ME EE2/Can. SE NAJ NAS CGC (Kona), CH Clanmarr's Steele Princess (Hattie) and CH Scotchbroom Thistle The Patriot SE (Sully) Visit: CroftersDream.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pkcrossley Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 i agree with greg, thanks SO much for making that clear. i'm glad bailey has landed with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kramersmom Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 My Missy thankfully never had a problem with her eyes. I never had to take her to an Ophthalmologist. When she passed at 17 she still had good eyesight. Her cataracts never got to the point of blindness, thank god. Kramer was playing with my son and a ball hit his eye. He squinted a little but next day we went to our vet. He gave me some drops to start and made me an appointment to see an ophthalmologist. He said they only have one set of eyes and I want a ophthalmologist to look behind the eye etc... It was well worth the office visit and tests were close to $400 but his eye was 100% good. A regular vet doesn't have the tools too see behind the retina where the ophthalmologist did, he did all sorts of testing, checked for glaucoma too where they check the pressure of his eyes. All was good. Glad to know you got a jump start on Bailey so if and when it ever progress's (Which I hope it never does) you will be aware and the ophthalmologist will check him often. I also thank you for bringing this up. After reading your topic I immediately checked Kramer's eyes and no brown spots. Rhonda,Kramer & Angel Missy "Blessed is the person who has earned the love of an old dog". "It came to me that every time I lose a dog they take a piece of my heart with them. And every new dog who comes into my life gifts me with a piece of their heart. If I live long enough, all the components of my heart will be dog, and I will become as generous and loving as they are" Missy Rainbow Bridge Memorial/>http://www.indulgedfurries.com/petdiabetes/memorium/missy2.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradl Posted February 11, 2009 Share Posted February 11, 2009 As mentioned above, the CTCA has been very active in supporting research regarding OM. In addition to an excellent and informative article in Veterinary Ophthalmology, there are research reports, general information about OM, some useful forms, and information about how to help with this research on our Health Concerns page. There is also a member contact for eye diseases (as well as contacts for other conditions) listed. I too agree that Bailey has found a terrific home. I'm glad he's there and also that jimnconnie join us here. CAIRNTALK: Questions? Need help? → Support Forum Please do not use PMs for tech support CRCTC: Columbia River Cairn Terrier Club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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