Post dental surgery

[anniegirl]

Hi! Banjo at 16 just had dental surgery and the poor old guy now only has 3 teeth. The unusual problem is after he eats he seems unhappy for a while, pawing at his mouth. It only lasts about a minute but we don't know what to do and its sad to watch. The vet says nothing is wrong. Has anyone else had this problem? 

[hheldorfer]

With only three teeth is it possible food gets stuck in his mouth, maybe between his gum and cheek?  Are you feeding only soft foods now?  

We have other Cairns on the forum who are in similar situations, so maybe someone can shed some light on this.

[Guest dog person]

How long ago did he have the dental surgery?   Because, I am sure his gums will be sensitive and maybe slightly inflamed for about 7 to 10 days.

I would feed soft food, presoak kibble.   Keep an eye open for inflammation/infection gum area.   Is he on antibiotics?   If not, you could ask your vet is this is indicated for a few days postop.

Otherwise, I agree with your vet.

PS: Maybe gently cleanse/rub the gum area (especially in the back where food gets caught) after meals with a little gauze wrapped around your finger and dog toothpaste.

Also, ask your vet if they took dental x-rays?   Were root remnants removed?   Cause, sometimes they get missed and can cause pain and discomfort, inflammation and infection.  

Edited July 18, 2018 by dog person

[Guest dog person]

If it has been more than 2 weeks since the dental surgery and the dog is still exhibiting signs of pain and discomfort, I would ask the vet about having  post operative dental radiographs taken to ensure that there are no tooth
remnants left.

Maybe I am overthinking, but my dog whose teeth looked pristine (vet's words) did not have x-rays taken,  so I took her back about 2 weeks post dental surgery due to obvious swelling and discomfort.   At that time x-rays revealed root remnants (left behind) that were removed and she had a full cleaning.   

No further problems since.

[Guest dog person]

Sometimes (especially with seniors)  a tooth is missing, appears to have fallen out naturally.    Or a tooth appears to have been broken off due to chewing on bones or hard objects.    One might assume that it is a clean break.   Without x-rays,  you really can't tell until symptoms develop.   Often the root is still in there, not visible to the naked eye.

Hence, the importance of dental x-rays.  See what your vet recommends.

Edited July 18, 2018 by dog person

[anniegirl]

Thank you so much! I will check between his gums and cheek. He is a bit of a Felix Unger and he hates anything that sticks to him, paws or otherwise. It probably feels strange and he is trying to remedy it. I appreciate your reply.

[Min D]

Our previous cairn had quite a few of her teeth removed. Maybe the discomfort yours is showing  is just for a bit until everything heals....we were told once it’s healed you would never know teeth were missing. That proved to be very true, the gums toughened up and she ate as if she still had her teeth.

[Pepper Bug's Mom]

ooohhh - Pepper just had her teeth cleaned today - the vet called and said they needed to pull one of her upper incisors - cracked tooth under the gum line....add another $200 to the $353 bill....I have Pet Insurance but $500 deductible.  She just turned 7.

Edited July 26, 2018 by Pepper Bug's Mom

[Guest dog person]

22 minutes ago, Pepper Bug's Mom said:

ooohhh - Pepper just had her teeth cleaned today - the vet called and said they needed to pull one of her upper incisors - cracked tooth under the gum line....add another $200 to the $353 bill....I have Pet Insurance but $500 deductible.  She just turned 7.

 

Exactly, that's what I am talking about!   Be very grateful the vet did x-rays and found it.    Otherwise, pain, discomfort and other potential health issues down the road.

They can't do the x-rays unless the dog is under general anesthesia.    That is why the "no anesthesia cleanings" are merely cosmetic.

[Hillscreek]

Pepper you are very very cute and sweet. Love your pic. Glad you had that tooth out before serious problems arose. The same thing happened to Angus - a cracked tooth. X-rays were taken to determine the under the gum situation. It was about two years ago and I may be incorrect in my remembrance but it seemed to me my vet said the anesthesia needed for cleaning and tooth extraction is less than when deeper surgery is done. No doubt it may be depend on each individual situation.

 Any way whatever it was Angus was quiet for a short while and before you knew it he was back to his usual busy inquiring self! No problems since.

[Islander]

This is very reassuring to me as Gus is scheduled for a cleaning and possible extraction of one tooth next month. At the same time he is having a lipoma removed from his hind leg. Neither procedure was considered urgent at his last health check but I want to take care of it while I have the funds. Estimate was $1200 Canadian (around $900 US) for the two procedures. Yikes!

[Pepper Bug's Mom]

Pepper's bill was around $550 - I have x-ray photos of the cracked tooth too.  The vet sent her home with some pain killers and she was quiet last night - she was even allowed to sleep on our bed with us instead of her crate by the bed...ha ha.  Today she barked and screamed at a squirrel, made it through a morning walk, snapped at another dog and is back to her usual self.  I haven't looked in her mouth yet (didn't want to humiliate her too much) but she gobbled up her kibble as if nothing was wrong.  I am wondering if the digging and biting at the rats in earthdog competition might have cracked that tooth.  Another Cairn that was a real champ broke a tooth in the earthdog dens a couple of years ago...

[Hillscreek]

Angus's bill was $400.00. I think that maybe mainly due to the fact that this is a poor rural area so vets just can't charge too much.

Think digging and chewing and biting at this and that may contribute to tooth damage. Certainly in Angus's case that big mouth and big teeth went to work tearing at tree roots digging for mice and voles. And no doubt it would be easy to chomp on a rock while tearing up the earth. I don't know exactly what happened when he cracked his tooth but I'm guessing something like that.

[Guest dog person]

On ‎7‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 3:25 PM, dog person said:

Exactly, that's what I am talking about!   Be very grateful the vet did x-rays and found it.    Otherwise, pain, discomfort and other potential health issues down the road.

They can't do the x-rays unless the dog is under general anesthesia.    That is why the "no anesthesia cleanings" are merely cosmetic.

Here is an article that describes anesthesia free cleanings,  I suppose if you are unable to do daily dental brushings and can afford it, it would work as an alternative, if it was done often enough.   May even decrease how often professional cleanings are needed.

http://avdc.org/AFD/what-is-an-anesthesia-free-dental-cleaning/

[Guest dog person]

This just happened to be in today's Herald!    "Dental X-rays help vet care for dog's teeth"   

The Vet Dr. John De Jong  Sunday, July 29, 2018       http://www.bostonherald.com/lifestyle/2018/07/dental_x_rays_help_vet_care_for_dog_s_teeth

My last comment on the subject, I promise  :-)

 

 

 

 

[sanford]

On this topic, Ruffy's teeth could use a cleaning, but he will soon be 11 years old and has a cardiac condition, so the vet refuses to clean his teeth because of the anesthesia involved. This doesn't leave us with any good options and although  scaling won't require anesthesia, I believe it's only cosmetic, so that won't accomplish what we need.

I would be curious to know if anyone else has a cairn in the same situation and how they deal with it❓❓❓

[Guest dog person]

Ask your vet for a referral to a board certified veterinary dentist, a specialist that is comfortable doing a dental cleaning on your dog.  If you search around the site, link provided below, you should be able to find one in your area.

They know how to take care of high-risk cases, including geriatric.

No, an anesthesia free scaling is not the same as a professional cleaning, it may be even more stressful for a dog with a cardiac condition as the dog has to be restrained during the entire procedure.

http://avdc.org/AFD/reasons-not-to-choose-anethesia-free-pet-dentals/

"Anesthesia free dental cleanings provide no benefit to your pet and do not prevent periodontal disease at any level. In fact, it gives you a false sense of security as a pet owner that because the teeth look whiter that they are healthier".

PS: I have had senior dogs, one at age 13 with a heart murmur got emergency surgery and had multiple bladder stones removed.   No problems at all.   Done at the emergency clinic.

Oops! I broke my promise :-/

Edited July 29, 2018 by dog person

[Guest dog person]

"Ruffy's teeth could use a cleaning"

What does this mean?   Are you concerned with the appearance of the teeth?  Bad breath? Inflammation?  Symptoms of discomfort?      Did the vet tell you that the dog needed a cleaning?   If so, he must suspect trouble.

If that is the case, and the dog develops an abscess  (pain, discomfort)  then you will have no choice other than to have emergency surgery at that time.    Whatever risk is involved.

Maybe it would be best to have a talk with your vet or get another opinion.    Just my opinion.  Other opinions welcomed, I will not debate.  I said what I needed to say.

Edited July 29, 2018 by dog person

[sanford]

I agree with you, Dog Person. I need to have a serious talk with my vet, who has been very good in most respects but this. She was dismissive of my concerns and gave only a cursory look in Ruffy's mouth, reporting that she could see tarter, but of course, she can't see beneath the gum line.

My concern is prompted by something I've mentioned here before: despite successfully  brushing (large, cooperative) dog's teeth in the past, Ruffy is a different story - his cairn mouth is too small for me to have good access to his teeth with even the small end of the brush. Unfortunately, rubber fingertip brushes don't fit my large fingers and I can't get my large hands into his mouth with gauze pads, so I'm somewhat at a loss.

I haven't seen inflammation, signs of discomfort and his breath is fine, but his teeth are somewhat yellowish and it's been approx 4-5 years since they were professionally cleaned. Lacking other options, I use a water additive to "soften" tarter and limp along with my inadequate brushing skills.☹️

Edited July 29, 2018 by sanford

[Hillscreek]

I can't give an answer to this concern. I can mention that in the "olden days" - fifty years ago or more - no dogs I knew had their teeth cleaned. Many had bones to gnaw. I do not recall any of ours having extractions. By the time the dogs were old their teeth looked terrible with much discoloration and tartar.

That doesn't mean we should treat dogs' mouths the same way today. But it may be a thought that in an old dog, with a health concern such as Ruffy perhaps one could just leave things alone and take a look in his mouth now and then for concerns such as those Dog person mentions. Do xray and/or surgery only if absolutely necessary.

Perhaps a consultation and second opinion might ease your mind Sanford. Keep us updated and in the meantime send us more pics of Ruffy hunting in the wilds of NY city showing his teeth at the squirrels etc

[Sam I Am]

I agree Hillcreek with the bones keeping teeth clean. All teeth discolour with age so if your vet isn’t worried I wouldn’t go looking for trouble. Our Previous Scottie was on a home cooked diet with bones and when she died at the age of 12 her teeth were immaculate, never had them cleaned . I truly believe diet plays a big role in dental health.

[Guest dog person]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯   I guess what we have here is a difference of opinion, regarding bones and raw or home cooked diets for dogs)

Why does my dog need dental work if I only feed a raw diet?
“Raw food diets are often based on uncooked meats, bones and vegetables. Some people report that their dog’s teeth appear “cleaner” and have less tartar when fed a raw diet. This is probably because of the increased chewing action which does provide some benefit. However, the incidence of fractured teeth increases in dogs that are eating bones. Periodontal disease can also develop hidden underneath the gum line, even without tartar on the teeth, where it will not be seen until your pet is anesthetized for a full examination and dental cleaning”. excerpt from: https://vetdentistrynm.com/about-us/faq/

Edited August 3, 2018 by dog person