Runaway Pepa

[Nordeste]

 Hi all. Long time no see, but I'm eventually here. I had spoken to you about Pepa, which is our Cairn Terrier puppy, when she was still in the hands of her old family. She's now six months old and is an adorable, lively and above all absolutely funny little dog. Very, very Cairn Terrier in all senses. She was a gift for Mum but she seems to have developed a closer relationship... with me. Well, this makes sense because I spend more time training her than Mum does, but... it was not the plan. Nonetheless, the matter of this thread is slightly different. 

 I'm not new to canine training and/or Terriers in particular. During the last 22 years my family has seen two American Staffordshire Terriers, a Staffordshire Bull Terrier, a West Highland, a Yorkshire and now our Cairn. The two Am Staffs were trained by me, under the supervision of  a professional. I know how to attract a puppy's attention, how to reinforce positive behaviour and a few of those different tricks associated with teaching them to come over when called upon. I have to say, however, that this little one has gotten me by surprise. 

 I have to say that prior to her first experiences outside, at home she was responding pretty well when called upon, which she still does. Sometimes you may call her and she will show up and stop a couple of meters away staring at you, pretty much like asking "what did you want me for". With this in mind and being my experience that all my puppies have always followed the "leader" (me) during their first "no leash" excursions, I figured Pepa would behave pretty much the same way. Mistake. Big one. We've had a number of incidents in which she would just fly off and not respond to any command, giving us quite a hard time to get hold of her again. It happened to me on the beach, happened to my brother a couple of times in the park nearby his place, and Mum had a terrifying experience when she managed to sneak out of her collar (yes, it was loose) and flew off in the middle of the city. She could have been killed that day, it just wasn't her time. She's been on a leash ever since, the leash being the average short one for their daily walk or the retractable one for beach or park outwalk. She has been unleashed a few times, too, but in confined and controlled environments, where there was a fence that would prevent her from escaping. In those occasions, I have to say that she has behaved very well, responding well to my call commands and even performing a sort of "emergency stop" when I saw her charge towards something that had moved behind a bush, and getting back to me when I called her. This brings some light at the end of the tunnel, I guess. I may be on the good way. 

 I know, for a fact, that Terriers in general are not "off leash trustworthy", or so they are told to be. Well, not in my experience. None of my dogs would run away from me like crazy and not respond to my calls. I presume the high prey drive of the Cairn Terrier plays quite a role in the situations we've gone through with Pepa and that her age is also a factor, but ever since the last incident (couple of months ago) we've decided to play it strictly on the safe side and she won't be let to run free until we are completely confident that she won't escape again. If she doesn't ever become trustworthy so as to be unleashed without danger and has to be always on the leash, so be it. Better safe than sorry. 

 I would love to hear your experiences regarding this kind of incidents, if you have ever experienced similar happenings with your little ones. Meanwhile, I'll go on with her training and will introduce distractions progressively in order to make sure that she understands what the "here" command means. So far I see a few challenges ahead that are related to the character of the breed itself, but we can comment on it later if you want to, to avoid making this too long (it's long enough already). 

  Thanks a lot for reading through it and looking forward to reading your opinions. 

 P.S: Photo is about a month old but it's all what was available right now. More recent and higher quality ones will be uploaded soon  . 

[sanford]

Pepa is gorgeous... And adorable as well! 

When I got my first cairn, I remember being told that they are not considered to be "biddable" dogs. ( A word I had never heard before). Their innate, independent character, combined with their ability to act and think for themselves is why they were bred to work on their own for the farmers in Scotland, going after vermin without the need to rely on cues and feedback from humans.

When I adopted my cairn, I was asked to promise to "never, ever" let him off the leash. Cairns characteristic prey drive can lead to them getting lost, injured or worse. Many cairns are skilled escape artists and when they do manage to get away, all bets might be off re recall.

In spite of this, you will be rewarded 100 times over with the pleasure of having a wonderfully unique dog like this in your life !

Edited January 11, 2018 by sanford

[Pepper Bug's Mom]

Oh boy - we have double fenced our entire yard - nice gated entry way to the front door as well....Pepper was/is a bolter from day one.  Once she escapes she keeps on going.  She is chipped and has a collar with no slip name tag on it as well.  She once went across the street and disappeared - we did the neighborhood search - calling, whistling, etc.  I finally heard her barking (the one time I was glad of her screech of death) in the neighbor's yard that we could not get entrance to.  The neighbor came out (not very friendly either) and said that my dog was barking at his rabbit that was in a pen in the backyard...I prayed that the rabbit did not have a heart attack and die on us!  We were able to get Pepper back and she was pleased as punch that she had been able to run free and even bark at a rabbit.  Most of the neighbors in our area are aware of her due to our walks and love her but she is hard to catch once she makes the great escape.  Our yellow Lab on the other hand would never run away and always comes when called - two different breeds!!!  Brodie (the 8 month old Cairn) isn't as bad as Pepper as far a bolting but has a mind of his own as well....

[bradl]

You guys are giving me flashbacks  In addition to the prey drive being a factor it seems like playing "keep away" or "catch me if you can" is a fun game for many Cairns. We've had several Cairn puppies who will bolt out the door if given a chance to explore the neighborhood. Most get more settled over time (8 years or so ) as they realize the best deal in town food-wise is right here at home.

But when they are loose at any age and on a tear it is heart-stopping. One frequently useful way to get their attention is to loudly run *away from them* — they hate the idea of missing something interesting and will often race after you. You can sometimes grab 'em as they zoom past you. I realize this is not super-helpful or safe in a city situation  

In our suburban neighborhood I have caught more than one partying puppy by falling down on the ground in my front yard, grabbing my knee and howling like a baby. They come running over to see what's up and I can snag 'em that way. Embarrassing but dire circumstances call for drastic action!

Your Pepa looks charming and a bit mischievous, in the classic Cairn style    Keep up the training. They are really very smart and can be trained with love and lots and lots of patience and persistence. And a good sense of humor.

[Sam I Am]

I can so relate to the fear of a Cairn  being on the lamb....I have gates in front of gates, checking collars, harnesses, shouting hold the kid someone is at the front door.  Sam when out on his daily walk, spots a rabbit (and we have many in our area) is on his hind legs screeching like a banshee, Practically pulling me off my feet. If he was off leash I would be searching for him in the next province. He has zero recall, and blots me out like I don’t even exist when there is prey that in his mind should be taken down. 

And then there is the catch me if you can game played out in the yard. This is where the clicker comes into play...clicker means treat and it never fails.....in the yard. Away  from the yard, nothing would work and its  wouldn’t matter because I would be dead from heart failure. 😵

[Hillscreek]

Please don't take this amiss....but I burst out laughing when I saw Pepa's  face and read where you say he looks around as if to say what did you want me for? Cairns have to be convinced that you really do need them for something and that there is something in it for them. Otherwise they are often too busy with their own life to bother.

Like you I have trained a few dogs and like you had to adjust my thinking when my cairn came into my life. Retrievers and spaniels for example can't wait to do what you want as soon as they understand what you are asking. That's their job in life - to work with their people. Terriers, and I personally think, cairns in particular, are used to working independently and making their own decisions about what's important.

I worked and worked with Angus and in general we became good partners but one thing I learned is when the prey drive kicks in he would never come to me. I think it was not so much deliberate disobedience or game playing but rather he couldn't help himself. I don't think he even heard me. He was blind to all except the hunt.Then after the vole or rabbit or whatever escaped he came running with his tail up, his eyes alight, saying OK what did you want?

If you have the time, the patience and a sense of humor I'm sure you and Pepa will become a great team.

 

[sanford]

19 hours ago, Terrier lover said:

I can so relate to the fear of a Cairn  being on the lam....I have gates in front of gates, checking collars, harnesses, shouting hold the kid someone is at the front door. 

I've written about this before: when visiting dog-friendly relatives with Ruffy, we had to run some errands, so we left him in the kitchen, behind 2 (tall) baby gates and a closed  pocket door.

As we approached the house upon returning, there was Ruffy, in the living room bay widow, happily wagging his tail, eagerly watching us coming up the front walk! How he defeated our "security" devices, we'll never know!😀

Edited January 12, 2018 by sanford

[Dempsy's Mom]

Oh my Gosh!  Pepa is soooo cute!  Would love to spend some time with her! 

[Moto-Rama]

Sorry to re-animate this thread, but...

This AM my wife was playing fetch with Fergus in an enclosed tennis court near our house, when Fergus noticed another dog all the way across the nearby playing field. He wedged himself through the closed and latched gate and sped across the field, then disappeared into the neighborhood. 

Diana frantically tried to recall him and ran after him but he simply vanished.

She trotted home to get her car so she cover more ground, when she noticed a group of people a few doors away on the sidewalk.  She ran over to ask if they had seen Fergus...and there he was, cowering on the sidewalk, clearly in shock. 

The people who had him said he'd been run over just around the corner,  they'd been able to grab him and restrain him and were calling Animal Control to come assist him.

Good grief, I was still sleeping while this entire drama was going on. I got the Cliff Notes from Diana, who had put him in our car. She said he was panting but not showing any obvious injuries. She then sped off to the SF SPCA who have a 24 hour Pet ER. I called them and told them what happened and that Fergus would be there shortly. 

X-rays showed no fractures or other gross injury, but they catheterized him, and put him on something to keep him quiet so they could observe him till this evening. 

Just in the past 2-3 months he's gotten reactive to cars, trucks, as well as a new willingness to bolt. He was often around other dogs in our local park, but stayed within a 100 meters or so, even while playing fetch. Due to his sudden change in behavior we've kept him I'm enclosed places and leashed. Unfortunately this isn't enough if he's determined to escape. Obviously. 

I've worked with him on Recall since we first got him and I'd say he was at 80% with me off leash, and 50% with Diana,  but he's been showing that his practical recall is basically Zero. He's 100% untrustworthy.

What's hard to take is that I've been working with him every day on this for the past month or so, and as long as he's in an enclosure or our yard, he's reliable.  Outside in the Real World, he's not.

His new reactiveness to cars is really strange. Before a couple of months ago, he totally ignored cars,  even when crossing in a crosswalk in front of traffic. No more, he gets the stare,.or suddenly reacts to moving cars that are within 50 feet, especially hybrids or electrics. They have some distinctive sounds that he's been noticing. 

I suppose relocating to a less stressful and more rural area where we could maintain a fenced-in  area would be a good change.  But it's a drastic move to take, on the chance that our dog would be less likely to escape. Expensive,  too!

Sorry for the long post. Maybe I'm just trying not to worry about our 20lbs of Trouble.

 

 

Edited October 11, 2023 by Moto-Rama

[Sam I Am]

Yes I can so relate! I would never trust Sam off leash. When I see how he reacts to rabbits or anything that moves fast he totally blots out any recall, even a favourite treat. He was a star in his puppy classes and teenage yrs also…but that was in a classroom. His breeder even has it posted on her web site that Cairns need secure fencing and can’t be trusted off leash as their prey drive is so strong .  I have an apple AirTag on his collar just in case just in case ! As the saying goes..you gotta love a terrier..Toto says we aren’t retrievers.
 

Thank goodness your guy is ok.

[Hillscreek]

20 hours ago, Moto-Rama said:

I suppose relocating to a less stressful and more rural area where we could maintain a fenced-in  area would be a good change.  But it's a drastic move to take, on the chance that our dog would be less likely to escape. Expensive,  too!

We live in a rural area. Same thing would happen here. All kinds of distractions, rabbits, squirels mailman UPS guy etc etc 

Very few fences would contain a cairn who wanted to get out whether he lived in town or country. They are amazing climbers, excellent diggers, and have large strong teeth to pull on or chew fence.

Obey excellently if they want to! 

Best keep on leash. Can be a long line if there is enough space.

[Dogcoat lady]

I love to watch dogs at liberty…..off leash is heaven for me and my dogs, Chesapeakes….but to enjoy my Cairn, Norrie…..she is on a leash.  The hell of loosing her far outweighs her running with the big dogs on 14 acres.
What Hillscreek has said, is correct.  Let me add, slipping thru a barely opened porch door!  They are determined.  

[Eliz222]

I'm happy to hear that Fergus is ok! This is my biggest fear, as it probably  is with all of us!

We don't have a fenced in yard, so Atticus is always strapped to me. During our daily walks he will sometimes pull to get closer to a squirrel, or bunny, but he doesn't do it often. I would never try to walk him without a leash, even though I see dogs all the time off leash (it's against the law here, but owners still do it).

[Moto-Rama]

Fergus may be "ok", with no broken bones or other gross injuries, but he's pretty banged up. Our vet says to keep him inside and on his meds for a week.

He can stand and has been able to eat a bit of chicken, rice and broth.  He's pretty bruised and subdued, and not at all very confident. 

I've postponed my annual.fishing trip to stay home with him. I'm kind of keeping a close eye on him till he's fully functional, peeing seems be OK, but his #2 function is not as good. Could be just that he's had less.food.

So, I'll have a report again this weekend. 

Keep them close!

[Dogcoat lady]

What a fright!

[Moto-Rama]

Fergus!

So, we got up this AM and Fergus still hadn't had a #2.   He had "that look" and was acting un-Cairnlike.

We decided to take him out to the backyward, thinking that his House-Training might've been inhibiting him. Sure enough, the smells of the great outdoors got him in the mood to get busy. He took a prodigious pee, then had his first #2 since Wednesday AM. 

Hallelujah.    Defecation is an important vital sign, so We can now breathe , too.  Plus....Spending another day and a lotta moolah at the SPCA Hospital would have been tough on all of us. (By the way, The San Francisco SPCA hospital is an absolute treasure. Considering the range and number of pets they care for, they do an incredible job. )

Ok, so while out in the yard after Fergus' moment, Diana turned around and Fergus was busy excavating a recently planted fern. "Hey, aren't you supposed to be recovering?"

 

[Moto-Rama]

As HillsCreek points out, a determined Cairn won't be easily discouraged by anything less than a formidably-built fence or wall.  Around here, despite being in a fairly dense residential neighborhood, we have all sorts of wildlife that can easily get IN to our yard or past the fencing we see in publc parks.

So there are other hazards to consider, in any type of area.   And Cairns just have absolutely no fear of anything, apparently.

Fergus has challenged German Sheperds, Coyotes and now, SUVs. So as far as I am concerned, from now on,  he's either under my control on a leash, or in my yard behind the security of a 6 foot fence. Period.

[Tracy A.]

What a sweetie.

So i've spent the last year training for an event like this.  The walking down as they call in my obedience class, where I yell "down" in my best drill sergeant voice and my little terrorist will drop where they are, or an in motion drop.  At which point I walk over and leash them or pick them up. 

The counterpart to this command is the walking stay, where they are in motion and I give a "Stand and Stay" command.

Last night both dogs went out the dog door and were barking at the apple trees (falling apples) like they were on fire.  They didn't want to come when called. I gave the "down" command and picked each of them up, one at a time and brought them in.

Here is a standing stay with Walter.

So my suggestion is formal obedience classes to train for events like these.

Tracy 

 

Edited October 18, 2023 by Tracy A.

[Moto-Rama]

13 hours ago, Tracy A. said:

What a sweetie.

So i've spent the last year training for an event like this.  The walking down as they call in my obedience class, where I yell "down" in my best drill sergeant voice and my little terrorist will drop where they are, or an in motion drop.  At which point I walk over and leash them or pick them up. 

The counterpart to this command is the walking stay, where they are in motion and I give a "Stand and Stay" command.

Last night both dogs went out the dog door and were barking at the apple trees (falling apples) like they were on fire.  They didn't want to come when called. I gave the "down" command and picked each of them up, one at a time and brought them in.

Here is a standing stay with Walter.

So my suggestion is formal obedience classes to train for events like these.

Tracy 

 

Impressive, but in the outdoors, without a leash attached? If your Cairn will "Down" , no matter where she is. That's kind of great.  

I have a Cairn that is 100% reliable, in a secure space. Outside of an enclosed space. Nope. 18 mos of formal training, and an hour or so every day at home. 

But the Call of The Wild seems to be the master of my dog when he's got no physical restaints. I've had 6 dogs, all types, mutts, mastiff, German Sheperd, labrador, Etc. None ever required a lead and heeled without much hollering. My mastiff would "Stay" for hours, same with my German Sheperd.

I am convinced these Cairns are not made of the same DNA. I've only ever had this one, though. So perhaps he's not typical?  

[Dogcoat lady]

No, I think that’s about the norm.  They are marvelous, though.

[Sam I Am]

Yup…Sam is totally fantastic in a class room with attached leash, a star. Get him with the wind blowing, squirrels, cats and basically anything that moves and all thoughts of listening to his human go with “the call of the wild”.  I would never trust him or our Scotty off leash .They are marvellous though as Dogcoat lady said!

[Tracy A.]

On 10/19/2023 at 1:26 AM, Moto-Rama said:

Impressive, but in the outdoors, without a leash attached? If your Cairn will "Down" , no matter where she is. That's kind of great.  

I have a Cairn that is 100% reliable, in a secure space. Outside of an enclosed space. Nope. 18 mos of formal training, and an hour or so every day at home. 

I am convinced these Cairns are not made of the same DNA. I've only ever had this one, though. So perhaps he's not typical?  

So yes, they will down outside. But I would never, never, ever let them off leash in an open area. Their prey drive is too high. The walking down command is an 'emergency fail safe' if they should get loose. I also use it in the backyard when they have say, caught a mole and I need to get it from them.

In my mind a loose Cairn, is potentially a dead Cairn... to be avoided at all costs. So have a plan in place because it will happen. See Walter (in the video) got loose at 6 months at the vet just after being fixed and ran straight into oncoming traffic. Cars stop, he lived. But since that day we've been training, and training hard- so that never happens again.

Edited October 21, 2023 by Tracy A.

[Moto-Rama]

He is slowly but surely reclaiming his Happy Go Lucky Ness.

After an 8 day staycation, zoning on gabapentin,  he seems like he's feeling more like himself. 

I'm keeping him confined to our backyard and the house for a while,  though.  No way he's getting ahead of himself after that steamrolling. I broke out a new Frisbee for him to chew on in the interim. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Dogcoat lady]

He is a cutie!  Stay close Cairn man.

[Moto-Rama]

Happy to report Fergus has physically recovered,  to 100% (I'd say) after about a 6 week stretch.

He is however still very reactive to cars while on walks, especially after dark when those bright lights contrast with the night. He's very happy to take a quick bathroom walk up the side walk, then play fetch and explore our fenced yard, instead of a lot of long walks.

I know he misses his dog buddies and the play he used to get in our nearby park. But I'm sure over time it won't be so hard to watch other dogs running off leash. Maybe there'll be some nostalgia but as we all know, being alive beats memories anyday.