Is this bullying behavior?

[sanford]

The 2 items below are from a list of behaviors that were described as bullying:

• Play barking and growling incessantly. Bullies don’t let up because they don’t respect other dogs’ body language and boundaries.

• Engaging in play in a very assertive manner, completely unconcerned about other dogs’ interest.

I'm concerned that this might describe Ruffy's behavior at the dog run where I was recently scolded by some other dog owners when Ruffy did this. (The dog he targeted was twice his size, but that may be beside the point).

I don't know if this is aggression, poor socialization or simply rough "terrier-style" play behavior on Ruffy's part. With only a few exceptions, he does this with dogs he knows well and (except for this recent encounter), they know him, as do their owners. We always found it amusing and the dogs make no effort to get away from him, so I assumed it was Ok, until this recent incident. 

Although my instincts told me this was only play-fighting, was I being negligent, or were the other owners being over-protective?... I just don't know.

Edited March 21, 2017 by sanford

[hheldorfer]

My first thought is that if Ruffy does this with other dogs and the other dogs tolerate it, Ruffy's behavior must not be threatening to them.  Regarding the 'target dog' during your recent visit, did the dog appear to be bothered or was it only the owner who was bothered?  What do *you* think about Ruffy's behavior?  Was it out of line?  As for the person/people who complained, are they recent additions to the dog park crowd?

There are so many variables here.  From our days of going to the dog park I recall Buffy acting similarly to what you describe.  In her case it appeared to me and DH that she was sometimes inviting the other dog/dogs to play.  She also did this when she saw a smaller dog being bullied by a larger dog; she never hesitated to come to the small dog's defense and insert herself between it and the aggressor.     

I'll be interested to hear what others think.

[bradl]

Sounds to me like the key factor is the other dogs' reaction.

Quote

 

• ... respect other dogs’ body language and boundaries.
• … unconcerned about other dogs’ interest.

 

I think it can be a tough call. The hardest part is that an over-protective owner may not be able to read their own dog's behavior to decide if it's really saying "enough!" or if it's engaging in counter-play, chase-me, etc. Especially hard is that larger dogs very often engage in mock-submission as part of play.

Dogs saying no go away usually have more than one 'tell' — hard to describe in words (for me at least).

[Idaho Cairns]

 "RESPECT other dogs’ body language and boundaries.

… UNCONCERNED about other dogs’ interest."

Those are human motivations and reactions--how in the world would/could we know if our dogs "respect" or are "concerned" with another dog?
If the other dog accepted the behavior, i.e. didn't react in an aggressive manner--carried on with whatever it was doing at the time, I would suggest that your dog was probably reacting normally to another canine in a new place with new stimulation. 
In my mind "bullying" (another trait understood as human) would be hard to determine as well unless the other dog made some unsuccessful attempt to avoid the confrontation with your dog, I probably would lay the incident as merely some irritation on the part of the other owner.
Dogs tend to sort things out socially more often than not and seem to do it better and quicker than most humans.
 

[Hillscreek]

Agree with Idaho. Dogs usually sort things themselves. Dogs are pack animals. In a group one or other will want to be the leader. Asserting leadership by bossing or trying to boss another dog seems to me to be normal dog behavior shown in play games many times. And cairn terriers always want to be in charge!! Learning to read a dog's body language correctly tells a lot. What special ability enabled the other dog owners to scold you? Probably none. You know Ruffy better than anyone. Let that be your guide. Go have fun.

 

[Sam I Am]

I agree that bullying is a human trait. I think back with Jocks behaviour towards bigger male dogs. It was fierce and yet he was kind and tolerant with baby Rosie. In Jocks case you would have to blind and deaf to not read his reaction to larger male dogs. He was the kind of terrier that I have no doubt about it, would get himself killed if allowed to "sort it out".  Sometimes you can see the ramping up of aggression, going from play into stiff body stance, erect tail, direct eye contact. At that point I definitely would step in. These little Cairns truly think they are the toughest thing to set four paws on the ground. I certainly have seen my share of really stupid uprights that couldn't see or react to a threatening dog if their own life depended on it. Cairns and terriers as a whole have this amazing zest for life, and what better way to enjoy that is by just being...well  by just being a terrier.

[hheldorfer]

I have to agree with all the above.  

Just a word about "bullying" in dogs, based on my observations:  I have seen dogs being "bullied"; being set upon by another (usually larger) dog and harassed incessantly while trying to get away.  I don't mean actual *fighting*, but rather a situation when one dog clearly wants to control another dog despite the second dog's objections.  That's how I would define bullying.

[Dempsy's Mom]

Dempsy would never bully - it's just not in his nature at all.  Elsie however bullies, but not to the point of fighting - she just lets the other dog know that she is her own dog and don't mess with me.   You know Ruffy best - so I agree just go out and have fun. 

[pkcrossley]

how do you mean a "list." did they give you a list? like, a printed list? have not been to a dog park, so don't know if they have neighborhood watch or what. daughters of the dog park. 

think idaho has called it. these people are anthropomorphizing. dogs don't know from bullying. there are leaders of the pack and there are followers. and there is most definitely play growling and barking. and there are also terrier behaviors, which sound like most of what is on the list. 

dogs who are afraid of other dogs run away from them. if dogs are too slow or too little to get away from threatening dogs, that is a grave safety issue. i understand that owners of other dogs don't want to take a chance that a dog who is growling at their own dog might be only playing or warning to see if he can get a result. it could be that the park has to be subdivided by size or age. people who are genuinely concerned about their dog's safety (not self-esteem) need to take their dogs home. if they are paying a fee to use the park, they should discuss with management how to get a refund or how to enforce safety. 

safety is the issue, not gentility. these people clearly regard the dogs as incidental. the park is about the people, and if they don't like ruffy's behavior or yours or whatever, that is a problem. maybe there is a way to sharpen up his social skills --sit, stay, come-- and you can call him to you when it looks like he is making some other dog's owner uncomfortable. but no he is not a bully (whatever that is for a terrier) and you are not negligent. evidently the dog park is complex, high-stress activity, so afterwards go home and be a schlub for a few hours. 

[Idaho Cairns]

Sanford, it has been my experience with community dog parks that an entire social stratum can build up over time.  The "regulars" often seem to take over ownership of the park by virtue of visiting on a regular or daily basis and that lead to "in" dogs and "out" dogs based entirely on perceived behavior by the predominate group.  It is a social pattern we see in our communities, neighborhoods, churches, schools, etc.--guess it is human nature.  Unfortunately dogs don't add it all up that way so they come lumbering in to a social situation and do what dogs always do--form their own relationships independent of the social beliefs and wishes of their human owners.  It creates problems (with the humans only of course) because the "out" dogs are "bothering the "in" dogs and that doesn't fit the social pattern that has developed.
As a Cairn owner we have learned, due to the nature of the breed, to take our girls to the "large dog" areas when the parks are segregated into "large and small" dog areas--it just seems to work out better for us and the girls if we let them chase and run with larger breeds.  Of course the girls could care less--they don't recognize size as an advantage or disadvantage.  Where there is no size segregation we simply let them interact and play where they wish to go.
Sammi tends to be very social, sniffs all butts and tolerates the same.  Bonnie, however, keeps her nose to herself and tolerates no cold or hot noses -- baring teeth and low with very sinister growls when necessary.  She never seems to get into a serious sparring match, even tho she is very small--Sammi, however, must give off "rough me up" signals because she seems, even with her open behavior, to attract right on the edge of dangerous, dog fights.  I have given up trying to figure out why the smaller dog manages to keep away  aggressive dogs and the larger of the two is a magnet--something mysterious and unknowable about dog behavior -- something they know/sense that we humans are excluded from seeing.
In any case, if your dog park is a municipal/public park and you are concerned, I would simply work it out with the objecting party--remind him/her that having her dog approached and harried is all part of the game and if she wishes to avoid the same, best not bring her dog to the park.  Might want to give a quick lecture on terrier behavior for the complaining person--let her know that Cairns, generally are the "Well this is fun!!!!" breed and by nature they are curious, persistent, and when necessary rough edged little critters. 

[sanford]

Thanks for all the helpful comments and support..

Starting with Idaho & PK- Their description of the complex dog park environment is very accurate; there can often be many layers to the owners' patterns of social interactions. When this is combined with the "unknowable" complexities of doggie behaviors, correct interpretations become an art, in my opinion, rather than a science. My admitted lack of skill in this regard prompted my post - and the reality-check offered by others here was both reassuring and enlightening.

      Like Idaho, I also take Ruffy to the "large" dog run for 2 reasons: Ruffy has no interest in dogs his size or smaller, so he spends his time sitting under a bench in the small dog run until he gets bored and complains to me that he wants to leave.  Also, this run has a very low fence which Ruffy easily jumps over in order to freely chase after squirrels in the park, so he must be leashed here, which sort of defeats the purpose of being in a run. 

To PK... The list wasn't given to me. I picked it up online and edited it down for brevity. It struck a chord with me, appearing at an opportune time. 

     Both PK and Idaho make valid points - recognizing that the dog park can sometimes be a high-stress environment,  combined with the fact that the owners who are not terrier-savvy might be over-protective and/or simply worry when Ruffy engages with their dogs in a dramatic way. Whether or not their worries are unfounded, I'm reminded that I should respect their concerns and have Ruffy back off.

    Others here asked about the target dogs' reaction. This has always been my guide. There has been no fear, no aggression on their part. When they run away he chases them and then they come back for more, play bow and it starts again, but I agree with the advice to sharpen up both of our social skills... Mine, to be more vigilant and intercede, and Ruffy's, to reinforce "stop!", "leave it!", "sit"!, etc. 

P.S. Yes, Helene, the uprights who objected were new to the park and their dog tolerated Ruffy, but apparently, Ruffy's aggressive style worried those owners. As Brad points out, it can be tough call.

Edited March 23, 2017 by sanford

[Islander]

I have stopped taking Gus to dog parks, except for a huge field at the university that is totally fenced. There aren't really dog parks in Victoria, just off leash areas, most of which are quite small and not totally secure. Gus wants to play with the big dogs too, but if they ignore him, he can get growly...or nippy. He does better off leash on hiking trails where his social interactions are briefer. 

People at off leash areas here are super cliquey, too. They stand around chatting and drinking coffee and occasionally throw a ball. I would rather walk! 

When Gus stole a ball from a basset hound (years ago) in an off leash area, her owner asked me, "Why won't he share?" 

Um, because he's a dog? 

[remltr]

My experience with Sassy at the dog park is so 180 degrees from what I am reading here.

At the dog park Sassy does not play with any dog, won't approach a dog, won't sniff a butt. She will stand still and let another dog sniff her for a few seconds. If it goes on longer than that she will start to growl and the dog usually retreats. She has never gotten into a fight or even wrestled with another dog. She is just mellow.

She sticks to me like glue, where I walk she walks.

I think this is because she was a show dog and then a breeding dog during the first 4 1/2 years of her life. I believe she never got the socialization that other dogs get. She never learned how to play.

I have only seen her play bow to humans. When I toss her a ball she may or may not chase it. If she does, she then wants to play keep away and that only lasts for about 30 seconds and then she is done.

If it doesn't involve treats she loses interest very quickly.

[Pepper Bug's Mom]

Our dog park is a neighborhood small park with only 3-4 dogs at a time - a big open field with a fence bordering parts (that Pepper can squeeze under and she has...) There has been a large labradoodle lately that has been giving the dogs grief.  Went after Teddy the lab yesterday (he is afraid of everything) and poor Teddy rolled and barked and gave up...however, Pepper (our little warrior) was ready to take on the labradoodle and take him out!!! Oh dear....lucky for me Pepper stopped when I said "NO" and the owner of the labradoodle apologized and leashed up her dog.  The labradoodle also went after a golden retriever dog, too.  Pepper has a 3 second butt sniffing rule and then she says "Back off!" and moves on!

[Pepper Bug's Mom]

Pepper also used to play with the dogs at the dog park but not any more...just trots along with me and Teddy and chases the ball as we walk the trail.