Last year I commented that I had run across a couple in Arizona who had a dog they called a "Norwich" terrier that I believed was a Cairn. I have also seen some rumblings that some Cairn breeders, seeking higher prices for their pups have cropped the tails of their litters and sold them as "Norwich Terriers". Take a look at this video and tell me what you see.

I agree that is not a Norwich. A friend of mine has one, and everyone at the dog park could tell the difference between Oscar my cairn and Iggy her norwich.

I've read on the web about breeders doing this, it's really sad for all involved.

Very interesting indeed! Looks like those folks have been had, so to speak. I personally would rather have a Cairn. I wonder if these people realize that they have a Cairn? I wonder how much they paid for this dog.

I suspect just about two to three times more than for a Cairn. Look at the comments with the video--someone suspects this isn't a Norwich. I would love to have a Norwich but I have never been able to talk a breeder into selling me one--they are hard as the dickens to obtain--at least from a reputable breeder. Don't get me wrong--the dog in the video is beautiful and I would love to have it but I would have to call it something different.

Norwich, my behind! That's a Cairn with a docked tail and it makes me angry that people would do something like that just to make a buck.

That dog looks alot like my Robby.

Yup, that Norwich is a Robby. .... and Robby is super cute.

What;s so special about a Norwich terrir?

Who posted this?

"

Not only does it look like a Cairn, It is a Cairn with a docked tail. That is done so the breeder can make more money from the sale of the dog.

The owner should sue for fraud, even though the owner still got a great dog. The Cairn is a great dog."

Haha someone from here I bet!

i could not even conceive of this before seeing this video. how disgusting.

who would want to disguise a cairn as anything else? but that is the least of it...

Edited August 29, 201212 yr by pkcrossley

Wait so these people cut the tail off the cairn to make it like a norwich ?

Despicable.

I am also disgusted . And at so many levels. That is a Cairn and a darn lovely one at that and for the owners I feel pity as they obviously did not do their homework. And of course the jerk that lopped off the cairns tail and committed an act of fraud...hopefully they have been caught in their acts of fraud and prosecuted!

Poor Fuego with his docked tail. The owners should go to the police with a fraud case. I don't think they could get a charge of animal cruelty since it's not uncommon for some dog breeds to get their tails docked. All in all a very despicable case but at least it looks like Fuego is a happy dog.

In our neighborhood we saw a couple with a puppy one time that they said was a Norwich and we had a lot of doubts that was the case. We have seen a grown Norwich at Pismo Beach once and it was quite different from a Cairn. Adorable little dog too. But yes, Idaho, they're very, very hard to get. They tend to have two puppy litters and I think they're all delivered via C-section.

I agree, this is really disturbing.

What;s so special about a Norwich terrir?

Who posted this?

"

Not only does it look like a Cairn, It is a Cairn with a docked tail. That is done so the breeder can make more money from the sale of the dog.

The owner should sue for fraud, even though the owner still got a great dog. The Cairn is a great dog."

Haha someone from here I bet!

Yeah, that was me. I tried to condense what was said in this thread and place it there. It won't do any good anyway. I just felt I had to say something even though it will fall on deaf ears. I would bet by now the owner has to know that their furry buddy is nothing more than a fantastic Cairn. Even though they were probably lied to, they didn't come out on the short end of the stick except for the money they paid thinking they were getting a Norwich.

What;s so special about a Norwich terrir?

Who posted this?

"

Not only does it look like a Cairn, It is a Cairn with a docked tail. That is done so the breeder can make more money from the sale of the dog.

The owner should sue for fraud, even though the owner still got a great dog. The Cairn is a great dog."

Haha someone from here I bet!

Yeah, that was me. I tried to condense what was said in this thread and place it there. It won't do any good anyway. I just felt I had to say something even though it will fall on deaf ears. I would bet by now the owner has to know that their furry buddy is nothing more than a fantastic Cairn. Even though they were probably lied to, they didn't come out on the short end of the stick except for the money they paid thinking they were getting a Norwich.

Well I agree, trying to exploit cairns for money is evil !

I was wondering about that tail. Really? They really chopped it off to look like a Norwich. Well. I guess I shouldn't be surprised. I see what they do to show horses and it is totally inhumane. So sorry that people are so greedy and stupid.

How does it get decided how much a certain breed is "worth"? Obviously supply and demand, but what's the difference in breeding practices between say, a Cairn and a Norwich? Do Norwiches have much smaller litters? Do the breeders go out of their way to keep the available puppies to a minimum? Do Norwiches not live as long? I've always wondered why some breeds are very rare (and very expensive), even if it seems that lots of people would like to have one.

Most Norwich or Norfolk ( which is almost the same dog but ears a bent over) have very small litters, 2 or three if you are lucky, and rarely 4. From what I understand from breeders always a c-section birth. I have also been told that if you want one once you put your name on the list it could be 3 to 10 years before you get one. These dogs are rare because most breeders do not want to fool with them because of the c-section and very few born.

This is what I was told from a breeder of Norfolks.

I was curious about the rarity of Norwich terriers and their breeding difficulties, so I went online to investigate. This link to a Norwich breeder contains some interesting information and includes a caution to prospective Norwich parents regarding puppy fraud (i.e. Cairns with docked tails, etc.).

And the pictures of Norwich pups are adorable. (Click on the link to "Puppies at Play".)

http://www.fantasianorwich.comoj.com/

Edited September 6, 201212 yr by hheldorfer

Lynn and Hheldorfer - thank you for the info! Interesting reads.

When we got our Mandy, many years ago, we were told she was a Toy Poodle/Norfolk Terrier mix. If the Norfolk's breeding practices and limited availability is anything like the Norwich, I think we may have been misinformed.

It truly is a shame that dishonest people are passing Cairns and other breeds as a Norwich. As we all know, they are getting a great dog, but certainly not what they asked for. I hate seeing well-intentioned, hardworking, honest people get bamboozled.

I don't doubt that people with Norwich Terriers love their dogs, but I've never felt comfortable with the idea of putting dogs through multiple (or honestly, even one) c-sections in order to get litters out of them.

I also hate the process of docking tails, as some breed standards require. I know they're young, and don't remember it, but it's a painful process that's unnecessary. I'm definitely in favour of legislation in the UK that banned it, and wish we would follow suit here.

Those norwiches have more of a foxy look to them, I don't really it that much to be honest. But I agree with _whits_ there should be some law about animal abuse with dogs.

Unless the dog is under anaesthesia , cutting their tail or messing with it, would be animal abuse IMO. Bet you that probably hurts and feels like someone is cutting off your finger...

Edited September 15, 201212 yr by Newman

We researched Norwich, Norfolk and Cairns (much thanks to this forum for helping us decide choosing a Cairns was definitely best!) and this looks like a cairn to me. I agree with some of the others here...so sad that someone would dock a cairn's tail to sell it for more money. I don't understand or agree with any sort of docking, ear pinning etc. I think it's all so cruel and unnecessary.

Lori - I don't know what they do to horses, I hate to imagine what those beautiful animals must endure.